1 00:00:10,000 --> 00:00:13,000 Heat. Heat. 2 00:00:52,160 --> 00:00:54,000 Part of the problem is when you use 3 00:00:54,000 --> 00:00:56,879 something, you know, as simplistic as a 4 00:00:56,879 --> 00:00:59,680 twootee device is you you don't quite 5 00:00:59,680 --> 00:01:01,920 believe in it. you think you're supposed 6 00:01:01,920 --> 00:01:03,920 to do more. You're supposed to write a 7 00:01:03,920 --> 00:01:07,680 big heroic theme. But anything we tried 8 00:01:07,680 --> 00:01:11,680 in there always led us back to this. Um, 9 00:01:11,680 --> 00:01:15,439 and so that's when we finally figured 10 00:01:15,439 --> 00:01:17,920 out, yes, those two notes will work. I 11 00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:20,720 mean, we we we had all sorts of other 12 00:01:20,720 --> 00:01:24,240 things playing over the scene. We tried. 13 00:01:24,240 --> 00:01:27,520 This is when we found our movie. I think 14 00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:30,080 I think it very much defined 15 00:01:30,080 --> 00:01:32,159 not just the style of this movie, but it 16 00:01:32,159 --> 00:01:33,759 defined the style of how we move 17 00:01:33,759 --> 00:01:36,000 forward. I mean, had it not been for 18 00:01:36,000 --> 00:01:38,720 this scene that you know the the Joker 19 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:41,119 stuff would never have been done that 20 00:01:41,119 --> 00:01:43,040 way. It's it's just it's it's we learned 21 00:01:43,040 --> 00:01:45,360 we can get away with the barest minimum 22 00:01:45,360 --> 00:01:50,520 of harmonic and um 23 00:01:50,799 --> 00:01:52,960 you know, tune. We didn't need a tune to 24 00:01:52,960 --> 00:01:57,159 go and play this. 25 00:02:07,360 --> 00:02:09,759 I had written a more heroic and more 26 00:02:09,759 --> 00:02:12,560 developed Batman theme and a more to me 27 00:02:12,560 --> 00:02:14,160 obvious one and and Chris actually 28 00:02:14,160 --> 00:02:16,720 really liked it and he kept saying, 29 00:02:16,720 --> 00:02:19,120 "Can't we use that tune? Can't can't we 30 00:02:19,120 --> 00:02:21,440 put that tune in somewhere?" And I kept 31 00:02:21,440 --> 00:02:24,080 saying to him, 32 00:02:24,080 --> 00:02:27,280 I don't I don't think the character is 33 00:02:27,280 --> 00:02:28,720 I don't think the character is sort of 34 00:02:28,720 --> 00:02:30,640 ready for that tune in a funny way. And 35 00:02:30,640 --> 00:02:33,680 I was hoping um that maybe he'll never 36 00:02:33,680 --> 00:02:37,120 be ready for for for the obvious uh 37 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:39,680 heroic tune. And Chris kept coming back 38 00:02:39,680 --> 00:02:42,640 to this and finally I said to him just 39 00:02:42,640 --> 00:02:48,120 just it's just not in his eyes. Um, 40 00:02:48,879 --> 00:02:50,160 and it was just, you know, it was just 41 00:02:50,160 --> 00:02:52,000 that communication. I mean, figuring out 42 00:02:52,000 --> 00:02:54,480 how to I had a feeling about something. 43 00:02:54,480 --> 00:02:56,160 My director had a feeling about 44 00:02:56,160 --> 00:02:58,720 something and um, you know, it wasn't 45 00:02:58,720 --> 00:03:00,959 that like he acquiesced. It was just, 46 00:03:00,959 --> 00:03:02,800 you know, oh, he saw what I was going 47 00:03:02,800 --> 00:03:04,480 for and I just couldn't figure it out in 48 00:03:04,480 --> 00:03:06,879 words. And it's but I think in the long 49 00:03:06,879 --> 00:03:10,560 run it it was worth both of our wild 50 00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:12,080 that we kept coming back to that 51 00:03:12,080 --> 00:03:14,720 conversation. You know, how much had the 52 00:03:14,720 --> 00:03:16,720 character developed and how much had he 53 00:03:16,720 --> 00:03:20,040 not developed 54 00:03:31,760 --> 00:03:35,680 the French horns for Batman 55 00:03:35,680 --> 00:03:38,480 is four French horns on the right, four 56 00:03:38,480 --> 00:03:40,560 French horns on the left, and they're up 57 00:03:40,560 --> 00:03:43,360 in a gallery up way above the orchestra 58 00:03:43,360 --> 00:03:46,239 in this church. So that's a whole bunch 59 00:03:46,239 --> 00:03:50,159 of microphones. Um because part of what 60 00:03:50,159 --> 00:03:53,200 you want is I want the ge the geography 61 00:03:53,200 --> 00:03:55,680 of where they are. So they have to be 62 00:03:55,680 --> 00:03:57,920 low microphones and they have to be high 63 00:03:57,920 --> 00:04:00,959 microphones that catch some of this. 64 00:04:00,959 --> 00:04:03,840 Then you have the orchestra which is 65 00:04:03,840 --> 00:04:06,239 basically playing tunes, long notes, 66 00:04:06,239 --> 00:04:08,159 whatever they're playing. um but not 67 00:04:08,159 --> 00:04:09,920 rhythmic parts because the rhythmic 68 00:04:09,920 --> 00:04:11,760 parts I wanted to have really really 69 00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:16,160 really super precise. So all that t 70 00:04:16,160 --> 00:04:18,720 these oenato patterns they were all done 71 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:21,199 separately which 72 00:04:21,199 --> 00:04:22,880 seemed like a really good idea at the 73 00:04:22,880 --> 00:04:26,400 time and it was painful and I thought 74 00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:28,080 hey wouldn't it be interesting to have 75 00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:30,000 something that was above the orchestra 76 00:04:30,000 --> 00:04:33,360 so that rather than just doing 77 00:04:33,360 --> 00:04:36,479 3D or you know not just do surround like 78 00:04:36,479 --> 00:04:39,680 this but truly try to try to impose some 79 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:42,000 idea of height into this thing you know 80 00:04:42,000 --> 00:04:44,080 at least have a go at it. You know, 81 00:04:44,080 --> 00:04:46,080 sometimes it doesn't actually matter if 82 00:04:46,080 --> 00:04:48,160 the audience really hears it, but it 83 00:04:48,160 --> 00:04:51,120 just helps me to think through 84 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:52,800 the architecture of what I'm trying to 85 00:04:52,800 --> 00:04:54,400 do by going, well, you know, okay, so 86 00:04:54,400 --> 00:04:56,720 the Batman signal is going to be above 87 00:04:56,720 --> 00:04:58,720 and the little motor is down there and 88 00:04:58,720 --> 00:05:01,680 the orchestra, you know, and the um 89 00:05:01,680 --> 00:05:03,840 percussion is really up in your face 90 00:05:03,840 --> 00:05:06,720 just just to to, you know, create a sort 91 00:05:06,720 --> 00:05:11,520 of a sonic stage. Um and you know in a 92 00:05:11,520 --> 00:05:13,759 in a f actually no but what what does 93 00:05:13,759 --> 00:05:16,080 happen as well by having the French for 94 00:05:16,080 --> 00:05:17,919 French horns 95 00:05:17,919 --> 00:05:20,320 um you know the whole width of a church 96 00:05:20,320 --> 00:05:22,639 apart from each other and just just the 97 00:05:22,639 --> 00:05:25,840 way they play up into the dome um 98 00:05:25,840 --> 00:05:27,680 there's a there's a great thing that 99 00:05:27,680 --> 00:05:29,759 happens to the rever it starts chorusing 100 00:05:29,759 --> 00:05:32,000 and the notes literally fly over to the 101 00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:34,400 other team and you know when they play 102 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:36,800 the other note something in the middle 103 00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:38,639 it it it becomes a really sort a 104 00:05:38,639 --> 00:05:41,440 gorgeous cord. So yeah, it's the the 105 00:05:41,440 --> 00:05:46,240 height thing was the conceit but the the 106 00:05:46,240 --> 00:05:48,160 way the cord is formed by using the 107 00:05:48,160 --> 00:05:50,240 building is not a conceit. I mean that 108 00:05:50,240 --> 00:05:53,400 really happens. 109 00:06:05,520 --> 00:06:07,840 The microphones are angled down. The 110 00:06:07,840 --> 00:06:09,199 orchestra sitting down. The microphones 111 00:06:09,199 --> 00:06:11,360 are slightly above them. And you get a 112 00:06:11,360 --> 00:06:13,759 sense of place. You get a sense of 113 00:06:13,759 --> 00:06:16,759 perspective. 114 00:06:21,919 --> 00:06:25,199 When I Howard started working on Batman, 115 00:06:25,199 --> 00:06:28,479 there was a endless heroic theme. And it 116 00:06:28,479 --> 00:06:30,240 just went on and on and on and on and 117 00:06:30,240 --> 00:06:32,960 and I kept 118 00:06:32,960 --> 00:06:35,440 thinking that's not that's not the 119 00:06:35,440 --> 00:06:37,759 character. The character is right at the 120 00:06:37,759 --> 00:06:39,840 beginning of the movie. 121 00:06:39,840 --> 00:06:44,080 The child Bruce Wayne as a child sort of 122 00:06:44,080 --> 00:06:47,120 is, you know, responsible. Not he's not 123 00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:49,360 responsible, but he but part of what 124 00:06:49,360 --> 00:06:52,479 sets his story and his fate into motion 125 00:06:52,479 --> 00:06:54,560 is that he wants to leave the opera and 126 00:06:54,560 --> 00:06:58,080 his parents get killed. At that moment, 127 00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:01,520 he freezes in time. It's like arrested 128 00:07:01,520 --> 00:07:04,479 development because partly what what I'm 129 00:07:04,479 --> 00:07:08,240 concerned with is how do I get an 130 00:07:08,240 --> 00:07:10,800 audience to suspend this belief that a 131 00:07:10,800 --> 00:07:13,360 man will dress up in a Batman outfit. 132 00:07:13,360 --> 00:07:15,280 Right? So, I think that's part of the 133 00:07:15,280 --> 00:07:18,720 job. Part of the job is to um 134 00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:21,520 legitimately I have to legitimately buy 135 00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:24,160 into this. And to legitimately buy into 136 00:07:24,160 --> 00:07:27,919 this, I have to make up some outlandish 137 00:07:27,919 --> 00:07:29,840 theories that I believe. I have to 138 00:07:29,840 --> 00:07:33,520 believe in the character. Um, and and 139 00:07:33,520 --> 00:07:35,680 one of the things which which I kept 140 00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:39,199 thinking is is that 141 00:07:39,199 --> 00:07:42,160 he he I mean the reason I ended up with 142 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:46,840 just two notes was really that 143 00:07:46,880 --> 00:07:49,360 it's like what is the next phrase? He 144 00:07:49,360 --> 00:07:52,479 he's stuck his his his life, you know, 145 00:07:52,479 --> 00:07:56,120 he can never become 146 00:07:56,560 --> 00:07:58,800 he can never become that heroic. He's 147 00:07:58,800 --> 00:08:01,199 not he's 148 00:08:01,199 --> 00:08:03,280 he's stuck in that one moment in his 149 00:08:03,280 --> 00:08:05,599 childhood and and everything just 150 00:08:05,599 --> 00:08:08,639 circles around that, you know. He can't 151 00:08:08,639 --> 00:08:12,639 have a proper grownup relationship. He 152 00:08:12,639 --> 00:08:17,720 can't he can't become truly heroic. 153 00:08:18,400 --> 00:08:21,759 That that's that's you know 154 00:08:21,759 --> 00:08:23,919 that that's Danny Elfman's Batman. Mine 155 00:08:23,919 --> 00:08:27,280 isn't that mine mine mine keeps get 156 00:08:27,280 --> 00:08:30,560 getting stuck 157 00:08:30,560 --> 00:08:34,080 and there this this little nagging motif 158 00:08:34,080 --> 00:08:36,000 that goes all the way through and this 159 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:37,760 it's like this little clock is just 160 00:08:37,760 --> 00:08:40,479 driving him forward. It's like the, you 161 00:08:40,479 --> 00:08:43,279 know, we Germans are good with guilt, 162 00:08:43,279 --> 00:08:48,320 you know. So, I don't know, you know, 163 00:08:48,320 --> 00:08:51,600 um, so, so 164 00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:54,720 the, you know, the whole to to try to 165 00:08:54,720 --> 00:08:56,480 contain the whole character literally 166 00:08:56,480 --> 00:08:59,760 within one phrase is, you know, it's 167 00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:04,279 very efficient because I can, 168 00:09:04,640 --> 00:09:07,440 especially if you do a movie about 169 00:09:07,440 --> 00:09:09,920 original which the Batman begins 170 00:09:09,920 --> 00:09:13,279 obviously is and you don't see the 171 00:09:13,279 --> 00:09:15,680 Batman character, 172 00:09:15,680 --> 00:09:17,760 you know, he's not wearing the outfit 173 00:09:17,760 --> 00:09:20,240 until real four or something like this. 174 00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:22,800 So, so, so to to have a very efficient 175 00:09:22,800 --> 00:09:25,360 way of saying, "Oh, this is the Batman 176 00:09:25,360 --> 00:09:27,279 movie. This is it." So, you know, when 177 00:09:27,279 --> 00:09:30,440 you hear 178 00:09:35,600 --> 00:09:38,240 it's it's nothing nothing special. I 179 00:09:38,240 --> 00:09:40,160 mean, like like 180 00:09:40,160 --> 00:09:43,920 10 million composers have used this, but 181 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:46,560 it's sort of I'm quite purposeful. I'm 182 00:09:46,560 --> 00:09:49,519 quite deliberate about it. And and I 183 00:09:49,519 --> 00:09:51,600 think when you hear it, you know that 184 00:09:51,600 --> 00:09:55,000 it's Batman.